STEVE INSKEEP, HOST:
Secret documents show TikTok officials describing how habit forming the app can be for teens.
MICHEL MARTIN, HOST:
In the documents, state officials say a teenager could become addicted to TikTok after 35 minutes on the app. That is according to previously hidden portions of a lawsuit filed by the Kentucky attorney general's office. Kentucky Public Radio and NPR have reviewed dozens of pages of the lawsuit that were blacked out from public view.
INSKEEP: NPR tech correspondent Bobby Allyn has been reading. Hi there, Bobby.
BOBBY ALLYN, BYLINE: Hey, Steve.
INSKEEP: How was this secret material made public?
ALLYN: It was a huge mistake. Kentucky was one of 14 attorneys general that have been investigating TikTok for two years over child safety, you know, sent the company subpoenas, obtained reams of internal communications and internal studies. At TikTok's request, Kentucky and the other states redacted privileged and confidential parts of the suit. This is pretty common in lawsuits. But in Kentucky, the blacking out did not work. And our colleague Sylvia Goodman at Kentucky Public Radio figured this out when she tried to copy and paste a blacked-out portion, which usually does nothing.
INSKEEP: Sure.
ALLYN: But here, Steve, it worked. When she did it, the stuff behind the blacked-out portions were revealed. So since then, we have been reviewing large swaths of the suit that were never intended to see the light of day.
INSKEEP: OK, so what have you found?
ALLYN: It's been pretty startling. This material is quite damning. And again, these details have not been made public before, including company officials admitting in these internal messages that features like a time on app reminder are not expected to reduce screen time, as advertised, but instead aimed at, quote, "improving public trust."
INSKEEP: Ah.
ALLYN: There was an internal TikTok document that found the exact number of videos it took before someone formed a habit - 260 videos. And Kentucky authorities said that could boil down to just spending 35 minutes on the app, since the videos are so short on TikTok, you know...
INSKEEP: Yeah.
ALLYN: ...Four, five, six, seven seconds long. You're flying by on this app. Another section described how TikTok has demoted what they deem as unattractive people off the main feed. And instead, the app is promoting what the company sees as attractive users. Another document, Steve, quotes a TikTok executive talking about the app's algorithm potentially addicting minors. And this quote here really stuck with me. The executive says, we need to think about how the app might deprive young people of opportunities. And when I say other opportunities, I literally mean sleep and eating and moving around the room and looking at someone in the eyes.
INSKEEP: Ow. I mean, that quote from a TikTok executive hurts. But what has TikTok said now that its internal words have been made public?
ALLYN: I reached out to them and a TikTok spokesman condemned NPR for reporting on information under seal. And to clarify, the documents are now sealed, but when we obtained them, they were indeed public. And anyone - you or I or anyone else - would've been able to see through these redactions if you just went to the docket and pulled them. Besides that, TikTok said the company has robust safeguards and that they proactively remove underage users and have voluntarily launched safety features like parental controls and beefed up privacy for minors under 16.
INSKEEP: OK, so what do the new revelations mean for these lawsuits?
ALLYN: Yeah, well, these cases will be unfolding for many months to come. But the new internal communications we have from TikTok provide what the states will likely be showcasing at trial. And the states here are trying to portray a company they say hooked an entire generation of young people to an app, misled the public and buried its own research about a whole host of harms and instead pursued growth and profits.
INSKEEP: NPR tech correspondent Bobby Allyn breaking a huge story here in connection with one of our local affiliates, Kentucky Public Radio. Bobby, thanks so much.
ALLYN: Thank you, Steve.
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INSKEEP: Cleanup is underway in Florida from Hurricane Milton.
MARTIN: Millions are still without power. At least eight deaths have been attributed to the storm. Five people died when tornadoes touched down in a retirement community in St. Lucie County on Florida's east coast. So this was a serious storm, though not as bad as some feared.
INSKEEP: NPR's Greg Allen went through the storm. He's in St. Petersburg. Hi there, Greg.
GREG ALLEN, BYLINE: Hi, Steve.
INSKEEP: I was watching the forecasts. Storm surge was expected of as much as 15 feet in some places, and at least that didn't happen. Why not?
ALLEN: Well, you know, just a few days ago, Milton was one of the most powerful hurricanes ever seen in the Gulf of Mexico. But as it approached land, it did some things that hurricanes often do. It made this jog. In this case, it was one that took it south of Tampa Bay, which is an area that's really vulnerable to storm surge.
INSKEEP: Yeah.
ALLEN: The hurricane also weakened a bit. But even so, it hit the coast with 125 mph winds. But the effect was that the storm surge was much less than was forecast. It was just 5 to 10 feet above ground level in the area where it made landfall. Tampa Bay, as it turned out, had very little surge. Here's Governor DeSantis.
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RON DESANTIS: You did have storm surge in Sarasota, Venice, Charlotte Harbor and all the way down the west coast of Florida, and some significant storm surge, but not the worst-case scenario of what we were looking at.
ALLEN: Milton did a lot of damage but far less than what was feared.
INSKEEP: Yeah, and I want to pause to respect those who did suffer damage. I know it is serious. I know some lives were lost. But what have you seen around Tampa and St. Pete?
ALLEN: Well, here, there are a lot of limbs and trees down, but for the most part, the buildings and other infrastructure held up pretty well against the winds. A construction crane in St. Petersburg toppled into a building and then the fiber glass roof of the baseball stadium was shredded.
INSKEEP: Yeah.
ALLEN: But homes on the whole did pretty well. In St. Petersburg, I talked to Jenna Michael (ph) about what she was seeing in her neighborhood.
JENNA MICHAEL: There's definitely some with trees on their roofs. Like, when we were driving by, we saw some that significantly have damage. But for the most part, it looks like it's mostly downed power lines, downed trees, downed fences and not catastrophic damage to homes.
ALLEN: She had a 50-foot oak tree fall on her property. Thankfully it missed her house, though.
INSKEEP: I did hear you say, though, yesterday 19 inches of rain in St. Petersburg, among other places. Can that lead to flooding in days to come?
ALLEN: Right, that's what we're watching for now. A number of rivers across Florida are rising and are expected to flood, and they have been flooding, not just on the coast but also in central Florida. The St. Petersburg area, like you say, got so much rain, in one neighborhood, Melissa Anderson (ph) said she spent the day using towels, blankets, even T-shirts to stop the water from coming into her house.
MELISSA ANDERSON: Water was just coming into the bottom of the house, faithfully just kept coming and coming and coming until we couldn't stop it anymore. The whole bottom floor, yeah.
ALLEN: You know, like other people in the neighborhood, her house is not in a flood zone, and she doesn't have flood insurance.
INSKEEP: Ouch. Which raises another question, Greg. Second big storm in weeks. Are people getting fed up with living in such a hurricane-prone area?
ALLEN: Well, you know, that's always the question we have here in Florida, especially after these really destructive storms. The people I talked with in St. Petersburg all seemed to take Milton in their stride. I think one reason is that it did a lot less damage than Helene. And so people went through that - they said this one wasn't so bad. They all didn't have power yesterday, but one homeowner said, you know, you learn how to deal with it. If you've lived in Florida long enough, she said, you learn it's just part of the nature of the state.
INSKEEP: OK (laughter), and it has other pleasures of being there, without a doubt. Greg, thanks so much.
ALLEN: You're welcome.
INSKEEP: That's NPR's Greg Allen, who is in St. Petersburg, Florida, this morning.
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INSKEEP: SpaceX is preparing a test launch of the largest rocket ever made.
MARTIN: It's called Starship, and the company hopes it could lift off as soon as Sunday from south Texas despite concerns that it may damage the surrounding area.
INSKEEP: NPR science correspondent Geoff Brumfiel is here. Geoff, good morning.
GEOFF BRUMFIEL, BYLINE: Good morning.
INSKEEP: What's the problem?
BRUMFIEL: Well, the first thing to know is that SpaceX's launchpad is actually in the middle of a major wildlife preserve down there in Texas. It's home to hundreds of thousands of shorebirds, sea turtles and other species. And the launchpad is right up against a sand flat where birds love to nest. I was out there last month with Justin LeClaire, a conservation biologist with the nonprofit Coastal Bend Bays & Estuaries Program. And as we walked through the dunes next to the pad, he pointed out lots of debris.
JUSTIN LECLAIRE: So you can see some rebar kind of poking up through the grass all over, over here. It was basically, you know, a minefield of debris out here after that first flight test.
BRUMFIEL: That first flight test, the rocket was so powerful it actually blew up its own launchpad.
INSKEEP: Wow.
BRUMFIEL: And to keep that from happening again, SpaceX sprays nearly 200,000 gallons of water in this sort of incredible massive fountain under the rocket during the launch. So that prevents the pad from blowing up, but it's created a new problem. The water isn't contained - it just flows out onto the flats.
LECLAIRE: Quite a lot does spill off, either is projected off or kind of runs off.
INSKEEP: OK, I'm trying to get my brain around that amount. It's hard to conceive of that number, but it's not a bucket full. It's not a bathtub. It's an unbelievable flow of water. Is this allowed?
BRUMFIEL: No. Under the Clean Water Act, SpaceX needs to have a special industrial wastewater permit. NPR reviewed documents and correspondence between the company and regulators and found they were told multiple times to get the permit by the EPA earlier this year. But they kept launching, even after the EPA told them twice this violated the law. Finally, in July, they did apply for the permit from Texas regulators. But they've been fined roughly $150,000 by state and federal regulators for the violations, and that's what's been holding up this launch.
INSKEEP: OK, I do want to note we're talking about wetlands, and this is water. Is this water in some way hazardous?
BRUMFIEL: Now, SpaceX has put out a lengthy statement about this whole situation. They say this is a paperwork issue, the water being used is drinking water, and that is true. But experts I spoke to said, it's not true that the water is drinkable after it comes in contact with the exhaust of the largest rocket ever built.
INSKEEP: Ah.
BRUMFIEL: In its permit application, SpaceX submitted some tests it had done, and those showed high levels of dissolved solids, zinc and something called hexavalent chromium. None of this you want to drink, according to experts, and it's not particularly good for the environment. So it does appear regulators are willing to let this next launch go forward, so long as SpaceX does some testing and shares its results after the launch.
INSKEEP: What happens now?
BRUMFIEL: So this next flight is really high stakes. The rocket's giant booster is going to come back and try and land at the launchpad. That's important for SpaceX, for their plans to make Starship reusable. Of course, if it goes wrong, that means more debris is going to end up spread across the wetlands when the booster explodes.
INSKEEP: Wow. Geoff, thanks so much for the update.
BRUMFIEL: Thank you.
INSKEEP: That's NPR's Geoff Brumfiel. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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